Re: [spoon-discuss] Refresh Prop again

["Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 10/11/02 at 12:13 PM Wonko wrote:

>Quoth Glotmorf,
>
>> On 10/10/02 at 9:34 PM Daniel Lepage wrote:
>>
>>> Here's the Refresh Prop again.
>>> Changes:
>>> *added destruction of any loose Resource Units
>>> *fixed anything that involved random squares to work with random surface
>>> squares
>>> *added removal of points of destruction
>>> *added provisions for Engravings, Casino, Tower of Babel
>>> *added destruction of attributes Cursed, Dead, Toad, Buttplated, etc.
>>> *added setting of endzones (bcs they change when the Grid gets wiped)
>>> *added Watch going on for 2 wdays afterwards (to give us time to adjust)
>>>
>>> {{
>>> __Undoing the damage__
>>>
>>>
>>> [[************************** Part I: Societies
>>> ***************************]]
>>>
>>> Deactivate rule 1075 [[WBE speeder Upgrades; we'll wait on this 'til
>WBE is
>>> working right]]
>>>
>>> In rule 578:
>>> Append to Section A the text, " No Society may ever convey upon its
>members
>>> the power to take an action which they could not otherwise do."
>>
>> Something else:  Add to the end of the second paragraph of section C the
>> following: "Changes made to a Society's charter in a given nweek go into
>> effect at the beginning of the following nweek."
>
>Okay.
>
>>> Amend section G in its entirety to be:
>>> {{
>>> G. Creating a Society by Player action
>>>
>>> A Player may, no more than once per nweek, in the first five ndays of an
>>> nweek, declare a Society by stating eir intent to do so, along with the
>>> Society's Charter.
>>> The Charter must include a list of the Society's initial Members. Only
>>> Players can be initial Members of a Society created by a Player Action.
>>> Entities in the list other than the Player declaring the Society must
>state
>>> their acceptance of membership into the Society in the same nweek as the
>>> declaration, or will be dropped from the list of initial Members.
>>> If, at the end of the nweek in which the Society was declared, a
>proposal
>>> that nweek has barred it from existing, or the Society would have no
>>> Members, the Charter is discarded and the Society does not exist.
>>> Otherwise,
>>> the society is then created.
>>> }}
>>
>> That takes out G.1.  There's a reason for G.1.  It doesn't allow the
>creation
>> of a society of unknown/unknowable status if the proposal that does so
>screws
>> up and leaves something out.  Like, you know, whatcha call...last nweek.
>
>But G.1. doesn't do anything. All it does is give people a method by which
>to do something, which they could do anyway. It's entirely redundant, and
>doesn't stop people from doing anything.

Earlier CFIs have stated that explicit definition of a method is sufficient to implicitly exclude other non-explicitly permitted methods.  If 404notfound would cease being not found, we might even get a ruling to that effect.

>>> Destroy all societies except:
>>> The Upper House
>>> M-Tek
>>> vSOI
>>> WBE
>>> OrcTech
>>> AS
>>>
>>> [[************************* Part II: NomiCrack
>*************************]]
>>>
>>> Deactivate Rule 1084 [[NomiCrack]] Destroy all Rocks of NomiCrack
>>>
>>> [[************************* Part III: The Grid
>*************************]]
>>>
>>> Amend rule 301 to add, in a position of the Admin's choosing
>[[Somewhere in
>>> section A would probably be best]], the sentence, "Whenever a rule
>refers
>>> to
>>> 'Grid Squares', it shall refer only to Surface Squares unless specified
>>> otherwise."
>>
>> This should not apply to the following:
>> R301.A.3 -- All squares, surface or no, have substance and depth.
>> R301.E.2.2 -- Tunnelling under a siren should not be that easy.
>>
>> Things to consider:
>> R301.D -- Elbonian throws can only be realistically done at the surface,
>> unless one is going to be teleported to the surface for the purpose.
>> R301.F.2-* -- Perhaps things can only fall onto surface squares, but
>they can
>> be taken into tunnels, and thrown, whacked, etc within tunnels.
>> R355 -- I personally think throwing should be possible in a tunnel, as
>long as
>> the target can be reached from the source by a straight line.
>> R394 -- Fumbling should get downright interesting. "Football go down the
>> hoooooole..."
>> R443 -- Punting should probably only be possible at the surface.  Or
>else the
>> punt range would have to be fairly short underground.
>> R498 (and others) -- It should probably only be possible to throw things
>to
>> and from Limbo at the surface.
>> R546 -- See R355.
>> R550 -- Uses the term "grid space"; other rules use the terms "grid
>square",
>> "grid location", "square", etc.  This will need standardizing.
>>
>> In short (too late :P), I think fixing the concept of surface squares
>may well
>> be outside the scope of a single refresh prop.
>>
>>> Deactivate Rule 1077 [[Mining - we'll fix this by proposal]]
>>
>> This one I disagree with.  I think mining is currently okay.  Especially
>if
>> things dealing with surface squares are taken care of.
>>
>> Yes, things can be destroyed.  Given that we've got bomb gnomes and big
>rocks
>> falling and other things, if something needs to continue to exist for
>the sake
>> of game continuance, that thing should have a provision for re-creation,
>> reincarnation, replacement, what-have-you.
>>
>> Strictly speaking, the Football does have such a provision, in the form
>of,
>> "There exists an entity known as the Football."  Since the football rule
>has a
>> lower number than the mining rule, it could be interpreted that the
>Football
>> is now resting on the new surface square.
>
>Bomb Gnomes are quite explicit in what they destroy. Big Rocks can't
>destroy
>anything save other Rocks - they break if they land on anything.
>
>The Mining rule is the ONLY rule in the ruleset that simply destroys
>*anything* on the target square. Everything else (even the Entropy
>Grid-Clearing) specifies exactly what gets destroyed, and only specifies
>things with provisions for being destroyed.

Still, I think the CYA should be on the objects, whether or not it's on the method of destruction.  On the off chance that some other rule that "simply destroys *anything*" gets implemented.

>As for the Football being destroyed, I see no reason why it should be on
>the
>new surface square. If it was destroyed, then it should exist again now,
>but
>not at any given Grid location. It just sort of exists in general, the way
>the Grid exists without having any specific location. Or, if it wasn't
>destroyed because a rule says it exists, then it's still right where it
>was,
>in the old surface square, which is now a vacant square floating above the
>Grid.
>
>Either way, things are confusing.

Still, I'd put something on the Football, to the effect that, "If at any time the Football is not on a specific square or in possession of a player on a specific square, or in transit on a specific trajectory, the Football shall be placed on a randomly selected surface square."

>>> Amend rule 1069 to replace the word "squares" in the first paragraph
>with
>>> "Surface Squares"
>>
>> Replace the phrase "Grid Squares" rather than just the word "Squares".
>
>Does it say Grid Squares?

Yep.

>>> Raise each player's Entropy by 2000 [[Triggering an Entropy Apocalypse
>to
>>> wipe the grid clean]]
>>>
>>> Destroy all Gnomes, Pinball guns, and Airspeeders.
>>>
>>> Put all surface squares on the same level. [[That's a really confusing
>>> point
>>> of the new Grid Rule - it seems to say that every surface square has
>>> elevation 0, regardless of whether it's been moved. Personally, I think
>>> that
>>> change alone could have been a prop by itself, as there are all sorts of
>>> confusing things in the ruleset now - like the fact that although we've
>>> obliterated the elbonia-squares, along with numerous others, but the
>>> surface
>>> squares of those surface units still appear to be on the same level as
>>> everything else.]]
>>
>> Not true.  It doesn't say that surface squares have elevation 0.  It
>says they
>> have depth 0.  Elevation is an absolute, based on the initial level of
>surface
>> squares in the grid; depth is a relative value, based on distance
>downward
>> from the surface square.
>>
>> But, okay, we can officially initialize them.
>
>Alright. I'm not sure I entirely understand where all this is...

It's all in r301.  Elevation is defined in the first paragraph.  Depth is defined in the first paragraph of A.3.

>>> [[*************************** Part VI: Honors
>>> ****************************]]
>>>
>>> Give each player a T-Shirt with the text, "I survived Nweek 24, no
>thanks
>>> to
>>> Wonko, Glotmorf, BvS, Orc, bd, or Wonko May Not Vote".
>>>
>>> Give Glotmorf one point of Respect, for creating the Deactivation rule
>that
>>> cut the length of this refresh prop tremendously.
>>>
>>> Give Glotmorf the title: "Lord of the Bulldozers".
>>> Give Orc in a Spacesuit the title: "Lord of the Gnomic Wastings"
>>> Give bd the title: "Knight of the Gnomic Wastings"
>>> Give Wonko and BvS each the title: "Knight of the Bulldozers"
>>> Give Wonko and Glotmorf each the title: "Most Disputed Bastard" [['cos
>of
>>> WBE]]
>>
>> Well, Dave said my WBE was the legitimate one, so that makes you most
>> disputed.  Les'n you're counting that speeder thang...:)  But hey, who
>am I to
>> turn down a title? ("Look, guys!  Matching T-shirts!")
>
>I disagree with that. I guess I'll have to CFI it. Except I thought I
>did...

You did.  But 404notfound is still not found.

						Glotmorf


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