Re: [spoon-discuss] Re: [Spoon-business] NWEEK 26 BALLOT

["Orc In A Spacesuit" <orcinaspacesuit@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

> From: Wonko <dplepage@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Quoth Orc In A Spacesuit,
> > On different times, different people voted:
> > > > Proposal 1203/2: Patching Up Societies (Wonko)
> > > YES
> >
> > I just want to make sure everyone realizes this:  there are problems with 
> > the current revision, such as it allowing people to get free charm, people 
> > to rack up point debt in a society and leave without having to pay up (and 
> > leaving the last one to leave to have to pay everything if everyone 
> > leaves), and overcomplication of points with the Point Balance mess.
>
> I fixed the free charm part.

Ah, yes.  My bad.

> Racking up point debt can be controlled by charters,

How?  The society can't forcefully require members to pay up; they can just 
leave, leaving the debt to be paid by whoever's left.  And because no one 
wants to pay, they will all leave, and the last one out (who may not have 
been responsible for most of the debt) has to pay everything.

> and none of you are under any obligation to join any society,

That's no excuse to have them broken.

> so
> the problem of dumping the debt and running is only a problem if you choose
> to make yourself vulnerable to it.

It's a problem if you join any almost society; if it deals in points (or may 
be able to in the future due to charter change), then you are vulnerable.

********
OOh, new problem found:  No BNS.  That would mean that WBE wouldn't work.  
Still.
********

> The Point Balance 'mess' is, as far as I
> can tell, the only way to prevent people from making proposals through
> societies, then taking the profits if there are any, but leaving the debts 
> otherwise.

And it fails miserably.  The society will likely have a way to distribute a 
positive balance, so they can take profits, but societies cannot require eir 
members to do anything, so people can leave debts.

> The only other solution is to force such changes to be
> distributed among the members, but I believe such distribution ought >to be 
> determined by the society; so my proposal only forces distribution when the 
> society is about to be disbanded.

Respectfully,
Orc In A Spacesuit

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