Re: [spoon-discuss] A proposal for next nweek?

["Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR  ***********

On 10/1/02 at 6:07 PM Wonko wrote:

>Quoth Glotmorf,
>
>>>
>>> I'm not circumventing the rules. One rule says that I'm allowed to make
>>> whatever proposals I want. Another says I'm allowed to propose to create
>>> societies. There's no conflict there - the two rules agree that I can
>>> propose societies in the one method, and one of the two doesn't care if
>I
>>> do
>>> it any other way.
>>
>> There is no rule that says you can make whatever proposals you want.
>There is
>> a rule that says you can make proposals, and another rule that says that
>if
>> you're gonna use a proposal to make a society you declare its charter.
>You
>> didn't declare a charter for it; you declared a rule that says it exists.
>> Therefore the society being created can't have been created that way.
>
>Well, first of all, the Charter IS there. The fact that it's also a rule is
>irrelevant. Secondly, there's no rule that says that if I'm gonna use a
>proposal to make a society I must declare its charter. There is a rule that
>says that if a proposal states a society's charter, then it creates that
>society, but that doesn't in any way affect proposals that don't declare
>societal charters.

Sure does.  It regulates the creation of a society via a proposal. Therefore, per Rule 18, your action doesn't qualify as unregulated and permissible.  There's precedent for this in the now-infamous Champagne controversy: since there are rules that say how a glass of Champagne can be created, the act of creating a glass of Champagne is regulated; therefore, methods other than those set in the rules are illegal.

And, no, the charter isn't there.  From Rule 578.C, second paragraph: "The Charter is considered a game document, and is maintained by the Administrator in a collection of Charters."  It's not sufficient for the charter to be in a rule, since the rule will not be in the collection of charters as a separate game document.  Had the rule as much as said, "There exists a society called WBE, which has the following charter: <insert charter here>", it might have worked, though you'd then have a society whose charter you flat-out couldn't change without a rule change.

So.  WBE won't exist as a society even if the proposal passes, because the proposal does not use the regulated way of creating a society.

You wanna see how to create a society?  Here's how you create a society...


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