Re: [spoon-discuss] Re: [Spoon-business] Veni, Vidi, Vacancy

["Orc In A Spacesuit" <orcinaspacesuit@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

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> From: "Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> On 5/4/03 at 7:31 PM Orc In A Spacesuit wrote:
> > > > From: "Baron von Skippy" <baronvonskippy@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> > > > > > I think mace ought to be more effective than herrings. And why
> > > > do you care
> > > > > > if I'm carrying you? You can't do anything by yourself.
> > > > > -Actually, I can. For one thing, I can not get thrown in the
> > > > Lake, not get
> > > > > sold, and so on... and I can move around by myself:
> > > > >
> > > > > Force Lifting is a Force Ability. It costs 8 Force, and must be
> > > > targeted at
> > > > > a carryable object that is within 3 squares of the Lifting
> > > > player's location
> > > > > and is not in the possession of another object, and another
> > > > square within 3
> > > > > squares of the Lifting player's location that the target object
> > > > could
> > > > > legally enter. When a player Force Lifts an object, that object
> > > > is moved
> > > > > from its location to the targeted square.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm a carryable object within three spaces of myself, aren't I?
> > > > Yes, I
> > > > > thought so.-
> > > > >
> > > > > [[BvS]]
> > > >
> > > > Yes, but...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > F. Carryable Objects
> > > >
> > > > F.1 Toads
> > > > Certain events may cause a player to become a Toad. Toads are Carryable,
> > > > Throwable, Passable MOs.
> > > >
> > > > While a player is a Toad, the following is true:
> > > >
> > > > Other players may occupy the same location as em.
> > > > E may not pick up, catch, or throw objects.
> > > > E may not make a move of eir own free will.
> > > > E may not use Elbonian Airways.
> > > > E is unaffected by Bonus Boxes.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > As the force rule states that the object is moved from its current
> > > > location, that would mean you wer moving of your own free will,
> > therefore
> > > > you cannot
> > > -Define "movement." I'm sure no definition out there as yet involves the
> > > expenditure of Force to lift oneself around the Grid. Therefore it's
> > > legal.-
> >
> > There was recently a similar debate, and and a CFI on that similar issue.
> > The issue was whether I could cause my speeder to move, and happen to drag
> > me with it.  There, it wasn't even me directly causing the movement; but
> > when using Jedi powers, you very much are causing the movement.
> > While I think that the rules allow both your attempted movement ane mine,
> > the Judges have ruled that moving oneself to be a very broad term.
>
> Any resemblance between this debate and the the CFI regarding sirens and 
> airspeeders is entirely superficial.
>
> The issue between sirens and airspeeders had to do with wilfulness...A 
> player in a siren's area of influence doesn't want to move out of it, 
> therefore doesn't want to generate an event that moves em out of it.

No, that's the /idea/ behind it -- NOT what the rules say.  Here's the 
applicable passages:

Sirens when I tried to have my speeder get me out:
"Players in a Siren's ZOE may only move to other Grid Squares in that 
Siren's ZOE, and Players in a Siren's ZATR may only move to Grid squares in 
that Siren's ZATR or Grid squares in that Siren's ZOE."

Toad/Penguins now:
"E may not make a move of eir own free will."

Nowhere does the Sirens rule say anything about free will.  Yes, that's the 
idea behind it, but that's not how its implemented.

Orc in a Spacesuit

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