Re: [spoon-discuss] Re: [Spoon-business] Veni, Vidi, Vacancy

["Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 5/4/03 at 7:31 PM Orc In A Spacesuit wrote:

>>From: "Baron von Skippy" <baronvonskippy@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>>I think mace ought to be more effective than herrings. And why
>>>do you care
>>>>>if I'm carrying you? You can't do anything by yourself.
>>>>>
>>>>-Actually, I can. For one thing, I can not get thrown in the
>>>Lake, not get
>>>>sold, and so on... and I can move around by myself:
>>>>
>>>>Force Lifting is a Force Ability. It costs 8 Force, and must be
>>>targeted at
>>>>a carryable object that is within 3 squares of the Lifting
>>>player's location
>>>>and is not in the possession of another object, and another
>>>square within 3
>>>>squares of the Lifting player's location that the target object
>>>could
>>>>legally enter. When a player Force Lifts an object, that object
>>>is moved
>>>>from its location to the targeted square.
>>>>
>>>>I'm a carryable object within three spaces of myself, aren't I?
>>>Yes, I
>>>>thought so.-
>>>>
>>>>[[BvS]]
>>>
>>>Yes, but...
>>>
>>>
>>>F. Carryable Objects
>>>
>>>F.1 Toads
>>>Certain events may cause a player to become a Toad. Toads are Carryable,
>>>Throwable, Passable MOs.
>>>
>>>While a player is a Toad, the following is true:
>>>
>>>Other players may occupy the same location as em.
>>>E may not pick up, catch, or throw objects.
>>>E may not make a move of eir own free will.
>>>E may not use Elbonian Airways.
>>>E is unaffected by Bonus Boxes.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>As the force rule states that the object is moved from its current
>>>location, that would mean you wer moving of your own free will,
>therefore
>>>you cannot
>>>
>>-Define "movement." I'm sure no definition out there as yet involves the
>>expenditure of Force to lift oneself around the Grid. Therefore it's
>>legal.-
>
>There was recently a similar debate, and and a CFI on that similar issue.
>The issue was whether I could cause my speeder to move, and happen to drag
>me with it.  There, it wasn't even me directly causing the movement; but
>when using Jedi powers, you very much are causing the movement.
>While I think that the rules allow both your attempted movement ane mine,
>the Judges have ruled that moving oneself to be a very broad term.

Any resemblance between this debate and the the CFI regarding sirens and airspeeders is entirely superficial.

The issue between sirens and airspeeders had to do with wilfulness...A player in a siren's area of influence doesn't want to move out of it, therefore doesn't want to generate an event that moves em out of it.

A toad, on the other hand, may in fact have a desire to be nmiles away from where it is, but lacks the physique to actually get there.  Were it to find some means of moving those nmiles independent of its limited physical structure, it might well employ them.

Were there to exist a CFI regarding this issue, and were I assigned judge of it, I might cite the difference between the noun and active verb form of "move", used in the rules to indicate the player-relevant action of relocating to another grid square in a nweek-delimited manner, and the more passive verb form of "move" having to do with bodies being set in motion, such as things that are flung.  A thing that has been flung by a player at someone is considered to be moving from the flung-from square to the flung-at square.  And since toads can be flung, they can, at least in that respect, move.

Heh.  In the time I took to type this, bd went and created the CFI.  Wanna give it to me, Dave?  I've got half the analysis written already...:)

						Glotmorf

-----
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