Re: [spoon-discuss] Re: [Spoon-business] Uh... Crap...

["Orc In A Spacesuit" <orcinaspacesuit@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

> From: Daniel Lepage <dplepage@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> On Thursday, April 24, 2003, at 04:46  PM, Orc In A Spacesuit wrote:
>
> > > Your charter was destroyed when it ceased to be tied to the game. There's 
> > > nothing there to modify.
> >
> > It exists.  Just because there's nothing saying the can be created now 
> > doesn't mean it suddenly disappears.  For a real-world analogy, if you 
> > blow up a Ford Motors plant, you aren't going to have a bunch of trucks 
> > disappear.  You just won't get any new ones.
>
> By real-world analogy, some rules you have for some club you're in don't 
> create objects either. What's your point? RW analogies, as has been shown 
> many times in the past, have no bearing on Nomic.
>
> It's not that they cease to exist because there's no way to create them; 
> it's that they cease to exist because there's no longer anything that says 
> they exist.

But there's also nothing saying the /don't/ exist.  And nothing saying they 
ceased to exit.  They did exist, and absolutly nothing has happened to 
change that fact.  Just because nothing specifies how they are created, or 
what exactly they are, does not change anything.

> > > > Now, that doesn't have the force of rule?  No problem!
> > > > OEPEVE modifies its charter to be a rule, with a Chutzpah of 4 and in 
> > > > Layer 4.
> > >
> > > Yes problem. Rule changes aren't covered by r18.
> >
> > "Rule Change consists of the creation (enactment), modification 
> > (amendment), or deletion (repeal) of a rule."  I'm not modifying a rule, 
> > I'm modifying a charter.  After the modification is done, the charter is a 
> > rule.  And I'm all-powerful.
>
> "Changing the Rules is permitted only as explicitly or implicitly described 
> by a Rule other than this Rule or a set of Rules not including this Rule."
>
> Not, "Rule Changes", but just "changing the rules". Adding a new document 
> to the ruleset certainly changes the rules.

You may be right, you may be wrong.  In either case, I still win, as 
described in my other email.

Orc in a Spacesuit

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