Re: [s-d] the Pause

[comex <comexk@xxxxxxxxx>]

On Friday 14 December 2007, Justin Ahmann wrote:
> What was/were DimShips?
>
> Codae, who is neither Dave nor Antonio

Here is a big message from a while ago explaining it:
On Feb 9, 2006 12:59 AM, Daniel Lepage <dpl33@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> 
> 
> On Feb 8, 2006, at 9:43 PM, comex wrote:
> 
> >> ...or search the mailing list archives for him sometime this past
> >> year explaining the DimShip Crisis to all of us.
> >
> > Actually, before I joined the game I saw mention of the DimShip Crisis
> > on the wiki but found very little in the archives.
> 
> I'm not sure the DimShip ruling applies to this proposal; the big
> issue with the DSC was a rule saying that some numerical quantity
> should be treated as though it were greater than its actual value.
> This caused problems when it was judged that "its actual value"
> should be subject to the rule's own modifications, causing all manner
> of trouble. One could interpret the lighting rule similarly, but one
> could also make a good case for how "increased by one" means "made
> one more than it would be *otherwise*".
> 
> For those wondering about the Crisis:
> 
> The DimShip crisis was (I think) the first major paradox in the
> ruleset. I claimed that I had won infinitely many times by repeatedly
> setting the world on fire and destroying everything. Glotmorf claimed
> that I had thrown all my money into a bottomless pit of redundancy.
> Rob settled the issue by ruling that most of the game was undefined.
> Hilarity ensued.
> 
> This was all during May and June of 2002. The first message that set
> everything off is here:
> http://lists.ellipsis.cx/archives/spoon-business/spoon-
> business-200205/msg00281.html
> 
> A slightly more detailed summary:
> 
> Rule 493/3 (http://www.bnomic.org/list.php?i=493&go=go)
> {{
> __DimShips__
> There exists a type of object called a Dimensions Ship, also known as
> a DimShip.
> 
> A DimShip is capable of carrying a Player through DimSpace by taking
> on virtual dimensional values: Buoyancy (positive virtual value) and
> Ballast (negative virtual value). A DimShip can take on Buoyancy or
> Ballast or a combination of the two, in any Dimension or combination
> of Dimensions.
> 
> A Player employing a DimShip does not travel to a specific location
> in DimSpace; rather, e displaces emself from eir current DimSpace
> location.
> 
> Ballast and Buoyancy are each limited to 100. Each can be set to as
> much as 100, even at the same time, for displacement in single or
> multiple dimensions. That is, no matter how many dimensions Ballast
> is gathered for, total Ballast must be less than or equal to 100;
> same with Buoyancy.
> 
> The cost to produce a DimShip is 100 score.
> 
> A DimShip, once built, can be launched, which puts it into active
> use. A DimShip that has been launched can be landed, which takes it
> out of active use. DimShips can be landed at any time, and must be
> landed when adding equipment or conducting repairs. A DimShip is
> automatically landed when its ballast and buoyancy limits are zero.
> DimShips can be launched at the end of the nweek.
> 
> If a player owns a DimShip and has launched it, then rules that check
> eir dimension values will check the values of eir virtual dimensions.
> Rules that change the values of dimensions, though, will change eir
> real dimensions.
> }}
> 
> Basically, a DimShip could shift you in any of the known dimensions
> (Score, Charm, Entropy, BAC, etc.). It cost 100 Score to build one,
> but you could then add a shift of up to 100 divided amongst all your
> dimensions, so that although you didn't actually have more points or
> less BAC, you would be treated for all intents and purposes as though
> you did.
> 
> I bought six DimShips. I put one at +100 Score, and the other five at
> +100 Entropy. My claim was that this boosted my personal entropy to
> 500, which thus trivially made Universal Entropy larger than the 500
> Entropy limit, causing the heat death of the universe. One of the
> side effects of the apocalypse was to set each player's Entropy, etc.
> back to zero and to give each player 10 points. But after the
> apocalypse, my real Entropy was reduced to zero but I kept my
> DimShips, and so I still was treated as having 500 Entropy,
> triggering another Apocalypse. This would happen infinitely many
> times, giving everyone 10 points. Every 90 iterations, the 900 points
> I gained plus the 100 Score Buoyancy from my sixth Dimship would push
> me over the 1000 points needed to win; I'd win and all scores would
> be reset. The process repeats ad infinitum.
> 
> Glotmorf's claim was that DimShips don't stack like that. If you have
> two DimShips with +100 Score each, then each one causes you to be
> treated as though your score were 100 more than the real, unmodified
> value, so your net gain was only 100 Score. By his logic, I'd just
> poured absurd numbers of points into buying DimShips when it couldn't
> profit me at all.
> 
> Rob judged the relevant CFI, and asserted that I was right that
> Dimships stacked with each other. But furthermore, e said "rules that
> check eir dimension values will check the values of eir virtual
> dimensions" applies to itself, so each DimShip stacks with *itself*.
> The result is that my score becomes equal to some number N satisfying
> N = N+100. This is impossible. What's more, a few other players were
> also flying DimShips at various levels, so we couldn't say anything
> about their Dimensions either. This cascades: Without knowing my
> score, we don't know if I've got enough points to Win, so we don't
> know whether the Clock is On or Off. Likewise, there could be an
> Apocalypse at any time; we wouldn't be able to tell if it happened.
> These two between them throw all other players' dimensions into
> doubt, which with the rules at the time called into question our very
> ability to make posts to the public forums.
> 
> So we declared a r0 State of Emergency, and disabled most of the
> relevant rules.
> 
> And now you know.
> 
> --
> Wonko
> 
> Estimated amount of glucose used by an adult human brain each day,
> expressed in M&Ms: 250
>       -Harper's Index, October 1989
> 
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