shadowfirebird on Wed, 13 Dec 2006 06:37:44 -0700 (MST)

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Re: [s-d] [s-b] proposal: RFJ system, take 2

> [[Since the RFJ system has, in my humble opinion, failed miserably,

I agree and I think this is very good.  Better than the mob, in fact.

A few points:  First of all I think that saying that the priest should
"use the rules for inspiration" is a bit scary.  I can stare at the
rules all night in a candle-lit vigil and that would be using them for
inspiration; but it wouldn't mean that my judgement would have
anything to do with what the rules *said*.  For me to be happy you
would need to say that the priest must judge using the rules and only
the rules (well, include past judgements too).

Second, I'm not sure about interventions.  If the judgement is
considered part of the rules, or even just a clarification of the way
the rules are read, then it seems to me that does the job.  We haven't
disproved that that bit of RFJs is broken - or have we?  You are going
to get priests ruling FALSE when they agree with the statement but not
the intervention, I think.  If you're okay with that, fine...

Finally, I do have a worry about zotting.  Say all this passes and
someone - for example me - is asked to be a priest on a consultation
that he feels isn't a valid one. So I ask the Oracle to zot it and e
refuses.  What the zark am I supposed to do then?  According to his
understanding of the rules the thing is neither true nor false.  And I
can't resign.  ...maybe that's it; you do need stepping down after

> like to propose this new Judgment system that incorporates some of
> David's Mob ideas. David, I actually wrote this last night and was
> consideing you to be away or busy with other things, so that's why I
> blatantly stole from you. I see that you are back, If you prefer to
> propose the Mob, I'll just scrap this]]
> [[
> things that have changed:
> Removed the Accepting stage of the RFJ which was kind of pointless.
> Removed Stepping down from Office, pointless too.
> Added corrective actions that can be requested.
> Put it all under a post (supposing Posts pass).
> Added an appeal process that all players may partecipate in.
> Completley separated it from the previous incarnation (and gained
> semi-silly-names in the process).
> Judges can no longer declare RFJ's invalid, only the justice officer can.
> RFJ numbering can be overridden by the justice officer
> Now has Active Players and a Quorum concepts
> ]]
> Create a rule called "Active Players" that reads:
> {{
> The group of players that currently possess the Active property may be
> called the Active Players.
> At the beginning of each nweek, the players that voted in the previous
> nweek gain the "Active" property, the players that failed to vote in the
> previous nweek lose the "Active" property.
> }}
> create a new rule named "Enough" that reads:
> {{
> A Quorum is defined to be any number greater than half the number of
> Active Players.
> }}
> amend rule 2-5 to read in full:
> {{
> == Judgment ==
> === the Oracle ===
> There exists an Object called the staff of ZOT.
> There exists a post called the "Oracle", he holds the staff of ZOT.
> === Consultations ===
> Any player may as a Game Action submit a Consultation.
> Consultations are Game Documents that contain a Question that is to be
> Answered.
> The Question must be posed in such a form as to permit a true or false
> reply.
> Consultations may also contain:
> * Reasoning, meaning text that clarifies the intent of the Consultation.
> * the name of a Player that is to be considered as the Unbeliever for
> that Consultation.
> * Interventions, corrective actions that should be taken out if the
> Reply is TRUE.
> That player submitting the consultation will be known as Supplicant
> regarding that consultation.
> Consultations automatically gain a Consultation Number upon submission.
> For each new Consultation, the Consultation number shall be equal to 1
> or, if such Number is already in use, to the greatest existing
> Consultation Number incremented by one. The Oracle may arbitrarily
> override the normal assignment of Consultation numbers, and choose a
> number of his liking for a new Consultation.
> A Consultation is in one of the states of Waiting, ZOTTED and Pondered.
> A Consultation is initially Waiting.
> === ZOTTING ===
> Upon submission of an Consultation the Oracle shall as a Game Action
> select a Priest for that Consultation.
> Alternatively the Oracle may wield the staff of ZOT and cause the
> Consultation to be ZOTTED, if in eir insight e considers the contained
> Question to be malformed, ambiguous, irrelevant or otherwise unworthy.
> ZOTTED consultations have no further effect.
> The Oracle may also ZOT a Waiting Consultation if has not been Answered
> yet and it's assigned Priest requests em to do so. In this case the
> Oracle is not required to grant the request, in fact e may instead
> immediately reassign the Consultation to a new Priest.
> === Selecting the Priest ===
> All Active Players, except the Supplicant, the Unbeliever if the
> Consultation names one, the Oracle and Players that have already been
> selected as Priests for that Consultation, are eligible for selection as
> Priests. If no Player is eligible, the Oracle is automatically selected
> as Priest.
> === The Answer ===
> The selected Priest shall find inspiration in eir knowledge of the Rules
> and, as a Game Action, Answer eir assigned Consultation TRUE or FALSE.
> The Priest may also submit his own Reasoning, explaining how eir
> mystical interpretation of the Rules has guided em in eir Answer.
> At the beginning of the fourth nday (or ndelay if the clock is off)
> after the Answer has been submitted to a public forum, the state of the
> Consultation becomes Pondered.
> === The Whole Point ===
> When a Consultation becomes Pondered, if it was Answered TRUE the
> Interventions contained in that Consultation, if any, are enacted.
> Pondered Consultations shall guide further interpretation of the Rules.
> === Automatic Reassignment ===
> At the beginning of each nweek, if a Consultation is Waiting and has not
> been Answered the Oracle shall select a new Priest for that Consultation.
> In the event that the clock is off, every 10 ndelays all Waiting
> Consultations that have not been Answered yet are reassigned to a new
> Priest.
> === Overriding Consultations ===
> When a Priest submits eir Answer to a consultation, within three ndays
> (or ndelays if the clock is off) since it's submission, any player
> except the Defendant and the Supplicant may, as a Game Action, make a
> Claim as to the Answer's Consistency with established doctrine. Such
> Claims will ultimately state that the player believes the answer to be
> Consistent or Inconsistent.
> If a Player submits multiple Claims, only the last one submitted shall
> be counted.
> At the end of the third nday (or ndelay) since the Answer has been
> submitted the Oracle shall tally any such Claims. If a Quorum of Players
> has submitted Claims, and there exist more Claims of Inconsistency than
> claims of Consistency, the Oracle shall reverse the Answer for that
> Consultation [[that is if it was TRUE it becomes FALSE and vice versa]].
> This reversal happens before the Consultation becomes Pondered.
> }}
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