Re: [spoon-discuss] Things wrong with "Junior G-Men"

["Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 6/30/02 at 2:56 AM David E. Smith wrote:

>Things wrong with "The Junior G-Men":
>
>First off, it in fact is not a proposal. My bad. For the time being (i.e.
>until someone CFIs this abomination out of existence) the "charter" will
>have that serial number.
>
>Second, it's got no members -- none of the named entities have yet
>declared their willingness to be members thereof (and, as NPCs, are
>unlikely to do so). The public rules provided for that society provide no
>way for Gremlins to join, and even if they did, the Gremlins have no legal
>way to accept the invitation.

According to Rule 578, subsection G.2, entities per se claimed as members don't have to state their willingness to be members.  Only Players do.

>Third, even if the listed Gremlins were members (which they aren't), none
>of them could make proposals. The society may *attempt* to do so, but
>there are no players in the society from which the required bandwidth may
>be drawn.

Rule 578 subsection F doesn't require that there be bandwidth to draw on.  It only requires that any Players who are members have bandwidth to draw on.  Since there are no Players in the Junior G-Men, this isn't an issue.

>Fourth, even if the other listed members could assent to membership, and
>could make proposals, they couldn't vote (their attempt to do so being a
>society rule, which defers to game rule 294). (This argument is a bit
>specious, but the others should make up for it.)

The attempt of the members of the Junior G-Men to vote is not a society rule.  It is a requirement under Rule 578, subsection F: "All Members of a Society auto-vote "yes" on any proposal the Society submits."  That means the members of the Junior G-Men are specifically allowed by the rules to vote.  Even if you interpret "these rules" to mean the text of Rule 294, Rule 578 subsection F has a Chutzpah of 2, and therefore takes precedence.

						Glotmorf


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