Re: spoon-discuss: Re: spoon-business: M-Tek

["Glotmorf" <glotmorf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On 5/14/02 at 5:28 PM Wonko wrote:

>Quoth Glotmorf,
>
>
>> As for not being "processed" like a proposal, so what?  R631 says a Club
>> exists when a player makes a Charter Prop and it's voted on; being voted
>on
>> implies a process that ties it in with the following sentence, which
>> determines whether or not the Charter Prop passes.  That the Charter Prop
>> isn't "processed" by the Administrator as are proposals doesn't keep the
>Club
>> from existing when the proper number of votes are cast for it.
>
>It says no such thing. Nowhere does it say "If a Charter Prop passes, then
>its Charter is added to the ruleset." No distinction is ever made between
>CPs that pass and those that fail, nor is any method given for determing
>when CPs do or do not create their Charters.

No, r631 doesn't say a Charter Prop makes a change to the ruleset.  But it does say that a Charter Prop makes a change to the gamestate.  The gamestate is not the ruleset; the gamestate is the sum of all actions taken since the beginning of the game.  One could even argue that the establishment of the original ruleset was the first action.

Creating a Club is an action.  R631: "Groups, as defined in Rule Five-Seven-Eight, also known as Clubs, can be formed by a Player making a Charter Prop, which is like a normal prop. in that it's added to the nweek ballot and voted on."  Thus a Charter Prop makes a change to the gamestate by bringing about the existence of a Club.  This doesn't require a change to the ruleset, any more than the Gnome Factory has to change the rules every time a gnome is generated.

No, the fundamental concepts of voting, and of passing or failing based on voting, are not defined in r631.  Some of the nature of these terms, however, is derived by the comparison to another game action whose success or failure is determined by voting.  Unless you can come up with a valid interpretation of these concepts that is publicly recognized and makes total hash of the logic behind r631, I think we can go with the precedent established already in the game of what voting, passage and failure mean.

						Glotmorf