Re: [s-b] harvest time

[Jake Eakle <jseakle@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

In the abscence of someone ruling this all to be completely ridiculous, i
throw them back at you forty-THREE times each. What NOW?


I suppose just for fun I should formalize that:

I throw all extant tomatoes at Phil forty-three times each.
And I throw the tomato from the town square at wonko eight times, just to
make absolutely sure.


On 10/25/04 9:14 PM, "Phil Ulrich" <phil@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

> I'll quote Wonko here, from the first tomato fiasco.
> 
> "2) The Tomato Fiasco
> 
> I cite CFJ 688, available at <http://www.bnomic.org/history.php?rn=688>
> . (look at the bottom one, that's the most recent). This CFI (then
> called a CFJ) was made in reference to the sentence
> 
> "A player may drink a glass of champagne by announcing that e is doing
> so in a public forum, this causes it to be destroyed."
> 
> The claim was that this sentence allowed players to drink Champagne at
> any time, regardless of whether they had champagne or even whether any
> champagne existed.
> 
> The ruling (see the appellate ruling, as the original judgment was
> overruled) was that since "a glass of champagne" was a defined game
> object, "to drink a glass of champagne" was not a standalone action but
> instead an action performed upon a game object.
> 
> By this precedent, "to throw a tomato" requires the existence of a
> tomato, as tomatoes are defined under the rules. So nobody has thrown
> any tomatoes."
> 
> Note that tomatoes now exist. All that throwing a tomato means is that
> I throw a tomato; nowhere in r1902 does it say I have to possess the
> tomato. In fact, you can possess it, for all I (or r1902) care.
> 
> I declare my intent to take my free throw against Personman, as well as
> throw the other two tomatoes at him forty-two times each.
> 
> --Phil
> =======================================
> "Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me
> because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a
> quarrel with mine, though I have not quarreled with him?" - Blaise
> Pascal
> 
> 
> On Oct 25, 2004, at 11:58 PM, Jake Eakle wrote:
> 
>> First, because they have existed for two nweeks, all existing vines
>> produce
>> tomatoes.
>> 
>> Secondly, I pick the tomatoes on the vines owned by myself, Phil, and
>> Wonko,
>> as well as the one on the Vine In The Town Square.
>> 
>> Now, there are a couple possibilities here. Either the rules is
>> interpreted
>> as it was meant, and I now own four tomaatoes and phil and wonko both
>> have
>> Free Throws against me which they cannot use, or it is interpreted
>> literally, and my having 'picked' these tomatoes is not defined, much
>> as
>> 'lay down' wasn't, to have have anything in common with the ordinary
>> english
>> phrase. In this case, i don't even own my the tomato on my own vine,
>> since i
>> have no means of getting it. After all, the rule merely says that vines
>> "produce" tomatoes, and says nothing regarding ownership or location.
>> Thus
>> it follows that now I have picked four tomatoes, and own none, and
>> Phil and
>> Wonko do have Free Throws against me, but still cannot use them, as
>> they
>> don't have (and can't have) any tomatoes either.
>> 
>> My case for the former scenario being the one that actually happens is
>> that
>> while 'lay down' in ordinary english really doesn't mean 'play' or
>> 'put back
>> in the deck', 'pick' really does mean 'remove from the vine and gain
>> posession of'. If I were supreme dictator of this Nomic, I would say
>> that's
>> what happens. However, that's also the way it works out best for me,
>> so I
>> leave it up to you all.
>> 
>> Also, just cause I haven't been given one yet, I draw a card. And I
>> pay 5~
>> for my vine.
>> 
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> 
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